[BB] Best by Best Game - The Continuation

[Penelope]

I'm of the opinion that, as stated so many times previously, that the Special Citation category should be reserved for those achievements that cannot be honored elsewhere. An impressive cameo performance can be cited in the Acting category, which is what Flipp is trying to do.

I disagree vehemently with Magilla placing Timothy Hutton in Supporting Actor for Ordinary People--when it was clearly and obviously THE leading performance in the film--but after one comment registering my opinion, I let it slide. I say we do the same here and allow Flipp his citation.

[OscarGuy]

Your reasoning is certainly understandable and makes perfect sense, but I wonder if this might not be a case for a Special Mention and not a supporting role. While her presence may add to the scene, it was the scene itself that you describe as having the impact. I have absolutely no problem with it being recognized there, but it sounds like Candy was an element of the scene as a whole and not the sole reason the scene itself worked.

But, that's my opinion based on what I've read and others are welcome to disagree.

[flipp525]

The disco scene does a lot of legwork in Klute for me. It serves as a clear moment of escapism for Bree Daniels -- escape from Klute's initial questioning; escape from "the life", if even just for the moment before she spots her pimp. She gets to leave her callgirl persona at the door and let loose with friends, people who accept her as Bree and not the vacuous object of no value she must assume when she's with a trick.

Bree, caught in a moment of stoned reverie, spots her friend Candy, shouts out her name over the din of the disco groove and then meets her on the dance floor. What Candy Darling adds to the scene, for me, is an element of the lure of the nightlife. She completes the scene and seems to know exactly what she needs to do in this scene which is to accept Bree as Bree is, right there on the dance floor, welcoming her into the rapture of the nightlife, if only for a brief moment. It's everything I'd want out of a cameo and I stand firmly behind my choice.

The scene is also deliriously evocative of an entire era -- moody and alive with period color. It's one of the few long, uninterrupted camera pans in Pakula's entire film. In honoring Candy Darling's "performance", I also honor the success of this scene.

Interestingly, my original choice was to nominate Dorothy Tristan's performance as Arlyn Page in the same film, a traditionally more "important" role. However, upon further reflection, I started thinking outside of the box and I really liked what Candy Darling added to the picture. Her very presence in the film even elevates Bree's fictional stature in the community -- as someone who'd be hobknobbing with the very "scene-y" Warholites.

I'm mystified as to why someone would get so upset, would expend so much energy to battle so vehemently against someone else's choice in a game like this. I am pleased that, as a result of this debate, my pick has gained such a spotlight so, I guess thanks for that, Big Magilla.



Edited By flipp525 on 1255452602

[OscarGuy]

I am also curious as to why someone would be included for a snippet in a film. I don't think the Rita Hayworth mention is really germane as Rita wasn't physically present in the film.

I also was not aware cameos were included in the acting category. It's been a long time since that discussion, which I really don't remember. I don't know why it wouldn't fit in with a special citation instead, especially in a situation like this.

It would be like Singing Telegram Girl in Clue. While not really a performance in my mind, it was one of those quotable moments that my friends and I have mocked or replayed endlessly since then. So, while it would be fun to recognize, I wouldn't, but I would be more inclined to include it in Special Citations than anywhere else.

If we had the discussion that cameos go in supporting categories, then Flipp is within his right to include anything he wants, but it seems an unusual choice to me, which I think is why Magilla is making such a fuss over it. I know I would like to get a window into Flipp's mind on this since obviously it was such a strong impact on him that he would want to include it.

[Cinemanolis]

I don't have any reason for questioning Flipp's inclusion either. However i do recall all of us bitching when the Emmys nominated Ellen Burnstyn for a few seconds appearance in "Mrs. Harris", even though she had some lines.



Edited By Cinemanolis on 1255419900

[FilmFan720]

I know I am not part of the game, but I am finding this argument fascinating. Flipp, if you can, will you just let us know why you feel this performance grants citation...I am just curious.

[Reza]

Please let's not bicker. Flipp should be allowed to keep his choice of Candy Darling if he feels so strongly about it.

Just to recap:

Sabin (if he is still around) needs to post his choices for both Round 1 & 2. Flipp needs to give an alternate choice for Art Direction and post his Round 2 choices. Both Hustler and Eric need to post their Round 2 choices before the game closes.

Let's move forward.

Thanks.



Edited By Reza on 1255406101

[Big Magilla]

I might not include it in my own list of great performances, but I think flipp has every right to include it as an exceptional supporting performance if he feels it has that kind of impact on his viewing of the film.

So if someone wants to cast a vote for Rita Hayworth in The Shawshank Redemption because her poster on Tim Robbins' cell wall had an impact on them, that would be alright, too, I suppose.

I'm not a moderator in these games, I'm just the recording secretary and fact checker and since the facts don't seem to mean anything I don't know why I even bother.

I'll be away for the next eight days with limited access to a computer. You guys do what you want.

[Penelope]

It's barely even a cameo--we don't hear a word of dialogue. But if Flipp wants to cite her, it's his privilege.

[rain Bard]

Here is the scene on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07UC5LCA6bI&

I might not include it in my own list of great performances, but I think flipp has every right to include it as an exceptional supporting performance if he feels it has that kind of impact on his viewing of the film.

I believe I have included (and I'm not the only one) in this game citations for visual effects sequences that were just as brief.

[Big Magilla]

I researched this.

From Chapter 19 on my Warner Bros. DVD:

Candy Darling is on screen for a total of 20 seconds in a scene that is silent except for loud blaring disco music. Numerous personalities including Harry Reems, Sylvester Stallone and Tom Hayden can be spotted.

Near the end of the scene, Bree (Jane Fonda) walks across the dance floor at the 64 minute, 19 second mark when we see Candy dancing to the left of the screen. She and Bree come together briefly in mid-frame. Bree whispers something in her ear, then sees her pimp (Roy Scheider) and moves toward him. Candy dances off to the left at the 64 minute, 39 point mark.

[Eric]

The reason this game was started was so that we could have freedom from these types of rules.

[flipp525]

Extras don't have names (Bree is very clearly calling out Candy's name in the scene). Do whatever you want, but I'm leaving my choice as is.

I have to say that I find your moderation of this game oppressive. I think you have a little too much fun being "in charge" of people.

[Big Magilla]

The Three Stooges' brief comic appearance at the end of My Sister Eileen would be an example of a cameo. Someone who appears in a crowd scene is an extra, not a star making a cameo appearance.

[flipp525]

Supporting Actress:
Candy Darling – Klute

Candy Darling did not "act" in Klute, she (he?) was an unbilled extra in a disco scene.

It's a "cameo" which, if I recall correctly, we agreed were placed in this category. The question of whether or not she is acting is really not up to you.

Please include in the record.