Avatar: The Way Of Water

[Okri]

As a production design showcase, it's phenomenal. I would like to visit Pandora, or even just a botanical gardens modeled after it. The less said about the plotting, the better. But the world is vividly created. I liked the action climax until the sinking of the boat. Then it just went on forever. The whale hunt was very well done. The sequel set-up scene is irritating for a number of reasons, but there was a video going around that discussed the amount of CGI in that scene alone and it's staggering - I think even the water dripping off Spider was CGI'd. But to what end?

Basically at it's best when it's a fictional David Attenborough documentary.

[Greg]

Not much commentary here, considering this is a movie that's been seen by most of the world.

Interestingly, even with all the money it has made, most people in the U.S. have not seen Avatar: The Way Of Water. It has so far made $626 million domestically. Because it is in 3D, average ticket prices should be at least $10. With even minimal repeat attendance, that means fewer than 60 million Americans have seen it theatrically; and, it has not yet made it to video or streaming. With a current estimated U.S. population of 334 million, that means less than one in five Americans have seen Avatar: The Way Of Water. I have no idea how this breaks down on an international level, as I have no idea how ticket prices vary from country to country.

[Mister Tee]

Not much commentary here, considering this is a movie that's been seen by most of the world.

I wasn't in the best frame of mind for the film, as it was preceded by coming attractions for an endless number of movies I hope never to see: the new Ant-Man of course, Shazam, Dungeons & Dragons, god help us The Super Mario Brothers. When a cornball bio of George Foreman is the grown-up movie of the bunch, you know the next few months are going to be bleak. And this was all punctuated by a young woman, sitting relatively close to me in the not-crowded auditorium, who cackled obediently at every lame one-liner -- a practice she kept up throughout the film proper.

This was a film that seemed too long almost from the onset. About 20 minutes in, I thought to myself, Okay, Visual Effects is a laydown, but do I have to watch 3 more hours of it? As it turned out, the visuals only got more amazing -- the film is close to being one giant special effect...to the point where, when Edie Falco appears in the flesh, you have to shake your head to be sure you're seeing a human being. Cameron absolutely has a gift for dreaming up amazing things to look at; the film is stuffed with maybe 50% more eye candy than I could ever have imagined or craved. I'm not opposed to this as guiding principle -- as a long-time Fosse adherent, I'm fine with excess. And I will say the film gave me major pleasure on this level; it's as easy a Visual Effects pick as any movie this millennium, with only Blade Runner 2049 as competition.

But, as always with Cameron, the problem is the thin plotting that supports the extraordinary visuals. He's like Tim Burton, only at 3 times the budget. The storyline manages to be over-complicated and simplistic (not to mention sentimental) at the same time -- which might just make him the ideal blockbuster director for this dumbed-down era. There was stuff I guess we were expected to remember from the original film, none of which was in my head. Meantime, the present-day story mostly amounted to Misunderstood Kid who keeps being underestimated but comes through for everyone in the end. (Kind of wild, that a guy who's one of the most successful, wealthiest directors on the planet obviously identifies with a character who doesn't get any respect.) The worst thing about Cameron's writing is that it's deteriorated over time. The original Terminator movie wasn't just celebrated for whiz-bang effects; it was seen as a fairly interesting, even witty story. Cameron still has the ability to craft decent suspense sequences -- though sometimes, as here, in more gargantuan form than necessary. I presume a lot of people will adore the final battle scene, but, for me, it went on FAR too long -- including what seemed to be Cameron's wish to restage some of Titanic along the way. Put it this way: my movie-going companions know that I'm a guy who sits till the last credit has rolled by...but not this time. As soon as the cast had gone past, I bolted.

On that cast list, by the way: I went to the IMDB last night to see which actors played (or, better, voice-overed) which characters. But, since they were only listed by names I'd never really heard/absorbed during the film, I still don't know who was who. Other than Kate Winslet, who I assumed had to be the other tribal mother (the only decent-sized role -- though still thankless, especially with Kate using an unrecognizable accent).

Perhaps singular to me, but, that character Spider: 1) I had no idea where he came from in the original movie; no memory whatever of Stephen Lang knocking anyone up; and 2) looked distractingly like Kato Kaelin. Oh, and add 3) ridiculously transparent, hokey plot device involving him to set up another sequel.

Bottom line: As with every Cameron effort in recent decades, I'm both impressed by his visual abilities, and depressed by the emptiness of the product he creates and the willingness of people to ingest it over and over. We've come to the sad pass in movie history where most audiences are happy to see the same movie every time they go to a theatre. That this is a first-rate version of that movie doesn't necessarily make it an exception.

[Sabin]

Greg wrote
There was some speculation that enough Academy members would want to show that they could support popular films that they would actually give Best Picture to Maverick.

I'm now celebrating six months of predicting that Top Gun: Maverick could win Best Picture.

I don't see many reviews of Avatar: The Way of Water on this board but I'll start it off. I liked it fine. The first Avatar worked best as a delivery system for an experience Cameron had dedicated twelve years to working on. The Way of Water doesn't quite match that first step onto Pandora but there's always something in the frame that I found amazing (in 3D). The underwater sequences are astonishing, both for their technique and also in experiencing an entirely new ecosystem. The phrase "Ooh, pretty!" frequently entered my mind. I also got a zip from some of Cameron's futuristic machinations. There are these crab-like robotics that are so incredible, we should have them. What works less well about these films is that this franchise still isn't that special. This is an effectively developed sequel full of smart calculations like making it a family story, but the characters are one-dimensional, derivative, and secondary to Pandora. And that's a problem because that's fine as a one-off but if we're going to get more of these films (and we will) I'm going to need to care about them and I don't. Avatar still feels like a delivery system for an increasingly busy wondrous experience. But in comparing Avatar to the alternative not the almighty, I found value in that wondrous experience.

On a side note, I'm enjoying Cameron firing shots at everything he finds problematic in comic book movies only to release his own franchise which is just as problematic. I used to mourn the loss of Cameron's talent in the service of these films. Now I just think Cameron was ahead of his time in calculating a frighteningly competitive blockbuster ecosystem.

[OscarGuy]

Or they'll give it to indie hit Everything Everywhere All at Once. Then they can show they can be "cool" too.

[Greg]

Avatar: The Way Of Water, just past its first week in domestic theatrical release with much of that taking place during the "winter storm of the century," has already made $293 million domestically. It has made $662 million internationally. Top Gun: Maverick, which had been the theatrical blockbuster of the year, has made $719 domestically and $700 internationally. There was some speculation that enough Academy members would want to show that they could support popular films that they would actually give Best Picture to Maverick. Maybe now they would ditch this idea and vote to give Best Picture to The Way Of Water, which a lot of people might find more justifiable on artistic grounds.

[Okri]

The response is intriguing to me and convincing me I need to give this a chance. I loathed the first one and spent 20 minutes irritating my parents about it on the way home from the theatre. I wouldn't let them pick the Christmas movie for five years after.

[Reza]

Another thing that is puzzling about Avatar: The Way Of Water is how the cast was trained to hold their breaths under water for several minutes...With the use of blue/green screens, mattes, etc., there should not be a need for actors to do so much stunt-like work as this.

This is true. When everything is digitized and pixilated, it shouldn't be a problem to simulate those things via effects as well.

So Sandra Bullock didn't go into outer space to shoot Gravity?

They say Neil Armstrong also never went into outer space. So Bullock is in good company.

[jack]

Another thing that is puzzling about Avatar: The Way Of Water is how the cast was trained to hold their breaths under water for several minutes...With the use of blue/green screens, mattes, etc., there should not be a need for actors to do so much stunt-like work as this.

This is true. When everything is digitized and pixilated, it shouldn't be a problem to simulate those things via effects as well.

So Sandra Bullock didn't go into outer space to shoot Gravity?

[dws1982]

Another thing that is puzzling about Avatar: The Way Of Water is how the cast was trained to hold their breaths under water for several minutes...With the use of blue/green screens, mattes, etc., there should not be a need for actors to do so much stunt-like work as this.

This is true. When everything is digitized and pixilated, it shouldn't be a problem to simulate those things via effects as well.

[Greg]

Another thing that is puzzling about Avatar: The Way Of Water is how the cast was trained to hold their breaths under water for several minutes.

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/zoe- ... 235413876/

With the use of blue/green screens, mattes, etc., there should not be a need for actors to do so much stunt-like work as this.

[Greg]

Avatar: The Way Of Water, the sequel to Avatar, is set to release only in theaters on December 16.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5F8MOz_IDw

This will again be in 3D, but, with glasses, not, as was rumored, without glasses.

https://www.cbr.com/james-cameron-no-gl ... -of-water/

In a head-scratching bit of casting, Sigourney Weaver will be returning, but, this time playing the adopted-teenage daughter of the Sam Worthington and Zoe Saldana characters.

https://screenrant.com/avatar-2-sigourn ... h-problem/